Claudia Winkleman and I are bonding over crisps; specifically, our shared love of beef Hula Hoops. ‘Stop it!’ she exclaims when I profess mine. ‘Those are my favourite crisps of all time. Now let’s discuss this in full detail. Do you like the puffed ones or the regular? The large bag or the mini?’
It could be a conversation straight out of The Traitors, a bonding exercise designed to lull your opponents into a false sense of trust by mirroring their taste in snacks. Or maybe I’ve just watched too much Traitors and have the show on the brain. I wouldn’t be the only one. Launched at the end of 2022, TV’s most Machiavellian game of wits soon had the nation hooked, watching avidly as 22 players indulged in intense psychological warfare within the grounds of a Scottish castle – a delicate shadow dance of lies and deceit wreaked upon the Faithfuls by the Traitors, who either had to guess their identity or face the ultimate punishment – ‘death’.
And now Winkleman is back on our screens in all her cosy-coated, cable-knitted, clompy-booted splendour, hosting a thrilling third season. ‘Just before it comes out, I get into this cold panic that maybe people won’t enjoy it,’ she tells me.
That the presenter of three of the biggest primetime TV shows – Traitors, Strictly and The Piano – is still worrying about them being watched and liked neatly illustrates the appeal of Winkleman, one of those rare stars who’d hate to be called one, doesn’t think of herself as one and is happiest letting others shine. It’s why she’s so good with people, be they Strictly celebrities or complete unknowns.
She’s bowled over by The Traitors’ success. ‘We didn’t foresee this. We went to Scotland with the amazing people who make it and a pair of red fingerless gloves and gave it our best shot. I think people like it because the psychology is extraordinary – just watching people work out whether they’re being lied to. The dynamics feel addictive. I’m completely obsessed.’
Which doesn’t mean she’s figured out how to win, despite her privileged view. ‘I don’t think there’s a formula. I wish there were. Although, actually, I’m really pleased there isn’t, because then people would know how to win. I do think the power of persuasion is everything. I also think you have to have a lot of empathy.’
So you don’t have to be a bit of a sociopath? ‘I don’t like the narrative that Faithfuls are good and Traitors are bad,’ she insists. ‘I wouldn’t make anyone a Traitor who didn’t ask to be one. That would be unfair. The Traitors are just as lovely, and that’s what for me makes it so compelling. I really want the Faithfuls to find one, and I also really want the Traitors to get away with it.’ Is she still in touch with any of the former contestants? ‘All of them. Aubrey sent me a video only today of some windows that he helped dress. I can’t let them go. I feel very protective over them.’
She’s tight lipped about the celebrity version of The Traitors, slated to start filming this summer. ‘I feel so bad because we’ve bonded over the Hula Hoop,’ she wails. ‘I would really like to tell you everything, but I really mustn’t.’
People like The Traitors because the psychology is extraordinary. The dynamics are addictive.
Of all the things that might have come to pass from The Traitors, becoming a fashion influencer wasn’t on her bingo card. ‘I don’t understand what happened. I’m a 52-year-old woman who happens to like a fingerless glove. I’m a tiny orange lady, and my fringe is too long.’ If self-deprecation suits her, so too does her Traitors wardrobe, a chic melange of cosy coats and knits offset with tartan. ‘I’ve always loved big sweaters and winter clothes. I’m allergic to summer clothes. I never want to see a shoestring-strap top or an open-toe sandal. I don’t do barbecues. I never leave the house between April and September. Give me big tights, a heavy sweater and a Wellington.’
It sounds as though she and her stylist, Sinead McKeefry, have fun constructing her on-screen persona. ‘For Strictly, one year I was Anita Dobson. This year I was Demis Roussos, which is why I wore a lot of kaftans. For the first [series of ] Traitors, it was Princess Anne meets Ronnie Corbett meets someone who is going to a golf sale. For series two, we went a bit Sarah Brightman. It was a large mood board.’
Off-camera, she has a uniform. ‘I wear the same black Topshop jeans – they’re falling apart, but I refuse to give them up – with sweaters that I’ve had for 30 years, DMs and either an ancient long black coat or one of my son’s puffers.’ But not a lace-up DM. ‘No – a bulky Chelsea boot. Who’s got time for laces?’
Not Winkleman, who last year stepped back from her Radio 2 show to spend more time with her children – Jake, 21, Matilda, 18, and 13-year-old Arthur – whom she shares with her husband of 24 years, producer Kris Thykier. The hardest part of being a parent? ‘Them leaving,’ she says. Her eldest two are at university. ‘It’s horrendous. I don’t understand why they don’t have that in the baby books, along with all the advice about breastfeeding and how to steam a butternut squash. Why can’t there be a chapter saying, “You’re going to have these little puffins that you’ll love more than life – and then one day, they’re off.”’
Matilda left for university in September and is studying chemistry. ‘She’s a very clever girl. She sends me some of the work she does. I’m like, “What? How? Pardon?”’ As well as one-year-old Skip, the dog she acquired to fill her emptier nest, she’s savouring every moment of Arthur still living at home – teenage hormones and all. ‘When they get a bit livid, I’m all right with it, and when they’re really embarrassed, I’m more all right with it, because I’m supposed to be embarrassing,’ she reasons. ‘That’s my job.’
If her teenagers are embarrassed about her, it’s only for the usual mum things, as opposed to something she said, did or wore on TV. ‘They have not watched me. They’re not allowed. Nobody watches anything I do in my house, under strict instructions. Although they broke rank and watched Traitors and I was appalled.’
Strictly recently celebrated its 20th anniversary, a fact she still finds hard to fathom. ‘I started presenting It Takes Two when my [eldest] son was one. I can’t believe I’ve been part of this amazing show for almost his entire life. How lucky am I to do Strictly, Traitors and The Piano?’ Suggest it’s talent as much as luck and she quickly refutes it. ‘That’s not faux self-deprecation. It’s the truth. I cannot believe how lucky I am and when it ends – and it’s got to be around the corner – I know that I’ve already had too long a run, so I’ll say, “Thank you so much and bye-bye.”’
Both she and her Strictly co-host Tess Daly are in their fifties, a fact that not so long ago would have precluded them from anchoring a primetime TV show. ‘I think it’s much better,’ she says of older women’s visibility on screen. ‘My bosses are all women, number one. And number two, I feel like there’s a home on telly for people who are older. But I would love to hear from people who disagree with me, because we need to hear those voices as well.’
She agrees that having more women in positions of power leads to a more female-friendly workplace. ‘My mum [former magazine and newspaper editor Eve Pollard] is a staunch feminist. She started an organisation called Women In Journalism and fought for more women on Fleet Street. When she was pregnant with me, there was no such thing as maternity leave. Can you imagine? I don’t know if we’re there yet, but one would hope that there is progress.’ We’ll raise a non-poisoned chalice to that.
‘The Traitors’ is on BBC One and iPlayer
TOP IMAGE - Photographer: Cody Burridge